Just saw somebody say this in a thread.
“I’ve been a fan up until now. But it was completely inexcusable to not have a trigger warning on this episode…”
My continued dismay with the whole premise of trigger warnings aside, can there truly be a viewer who has been “a fan up until now,” who has somehow gotten this many seasons into GAME OF THRONES and not realized that the story traffics in upsetting you with violent developments?
Seriously, Sansa Stark was escorted to her wedding by a fellow she ws raised alongside, who in previous episodes was chained to a wall and tortured at length, who was teased erect by a prostitute so his penis could be chopped off without anaesthetic, all this after he incinerated two children who he wants the world to believe are the two fugitive sons of a man who was beheaded and a woman who had her throat slit at the wedding of another son to a pregnant woman who minutes after they were pronounced Man and Wife had a dagger jabbed into her abdomen multiple times, at the behest of a family that includes a woman who is at one point raped by her twin brother, with whom she had a psychotic son who forced prostitutes to whip each other for his amusement.
And you want a trigger warning for THIS episode?
Were you under the impression that you were watching the Rankin-Bass version of THE HOBBIT up until now?
The argument is not whether GAME OF THRONES is any good, or uses these shocking moments in a responsible manner; I would say yes in both cases, but am not here today to debate the point. The argument is whether you can get past all that and still declare yourself violated without sufficient advance warning if the next development that comes galloping down the pike happens to upset you. How could you have not figured out by now that this story traffics in upset? It’s like having the vapors about gun violence the tenth time Dirty Harry shoots somebody. This many seasons in, can you actually pretend that you were unaware of the nature of the show you’ve been watching all along? Or did you watch the Red Wedding and think, “Okay, the bad part’s over, everybody’s going to be nice to each other from now on? It’s never going to get untidy again?”
When were you going to figure out otherwise, if not in all the years up to now?
Comment By: Jay Sheckley
May 18th, 2015 at 8:17 am
it’s called a tv. it’s a trigger.
Comment By: Jayme Lynn Blaschke
May 18th, 2015 at 10:17 am
I’d wondered what the hue and cry was about. Couldn’t remember anything of that magnitude at this point. Googled and Aha! They’ve gone way off-book now, haven’t they? I wonder if it’s intentional at this point.
Comment By: Adam-Troy Castro
May 18th, 2015 at 10:17 am
They’ve gone off-book because they had to. They know where the story is going, just not precisely how GRRM intends on takinf it there. They know the ending. They cannot know the details becaause GRRM, like most of us, discovers many of them in the telling.
Comment By: Jayme Lynn Blaschke
May 18th, 2015 at 10:17 am
Yeah, but from what I remember, there’s still a good bit of narrative in the books they’ve haven’t touched. This eliminates an admittedly minor character, but conflates the Arya and Sansa storylines in a way I don’t think can be neatly resolved. It is reminiscent of other changes they’ve made in order to retain/eliminate cast members, control costs, logistics, etc. Only turned up to 11. In short, I don’t think they *have* to go off-book at this point because of lack of material, but rather this was a change of choice.
No doubt we’re going to get a finale of the series that ticks off all the boxes to attain the resolution George shared with them when this all started, but one so very different in execution from the books that neither would serve as a spoiler of the other. My (meandering) point is that it feels as if the show runners have already internalized this and no longer view themselves as being restrained by whatever book narrative remains. They’re literally doing their own thing at this point, and if George finished Winds of Winter tomorrow, I don’t think that would change this. 🙂
Comment By: Laura Antoniou
May 18th, 2015 at 11:17 am
I’ve been calling the show The Most Expensive Fan Fiction Ever Made.
Comment By: Setsu Uzume
May 18th, 2015 at 12:17 pm
The problem with this fanfiction is that it misses the point. It doesn’t manage its drama in a satisfying way; it’s just horrible people being horrible to each other.
Yes, TV-MA is a trigger warning, and it’s unfortunate that this person missed it; but that’s not what’s wrong with the show.
Comment By: Adam-Troy Castro
May 18th, 2015 at 1:17 pm
^^^ See, I can disagree with that (as I do) and NOT consider it jaw-droppingly silly; it’s simply a different conclusion, that’s all. Again, I point out that the person specifically said she’d “liked the show until now,” meaning that she’d gotten five seasons into this saga of incest, child murder, genocide, genital mutilation, torture, rape, and the stabbing of pregnant women in the abdomen, without somehow being sufficiently “warned” that bad things happen on this show. THAT is what I consider inane.
Comment By: Greg Cox
May 18th, 2015 at 1:17 pm
“Wait! I didn’t know there were going to be axe murders on ‘The Lizzle Borden Chronicles.’ Why wasn’t I warned?”
Comment By: John Ordover
May 18th, 2015 at 1:18 pm
I -don’t- watch GOT and -I- know what it’s like.
Comment By: Garrett Cook
May 18th, 2015 at 1:18 pm
Trigger warning: this show has a complicated relationship with everybody’s junk. ALWAYS
Comment By: Jason Boone
May 18th, 2015 at 3:17 pm
There was a meme of some sort that was like “after all of that, THIS it what upsets you?”, but I can’t remember it. Instead, I shall merely /maximus http://thearabdailynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/are-you-not-entertained-w-text-720×396.jpg
Comment By: Andrea Thompson
May 18th, 2015 at 3:17 pm
if you don’t know going into it that every single person in GoT is in someway twisted and every single relationship is in some way dysfunctional, THEN YOU AREN’T PAYING ATTENTION.
Comment By: Steve Carey
May 18th, 2015 at 3:17 pm
*Spoilers*
Comment By: John Gorumba
May 18th, 2015 at 4:17 pm
They don’t really want a trigger warning; they want the narrative changed.
Comment By: Jim Wright
May 18th, 2015 at 4:06 pm
The show DOES come with trigger warnings.
Every single episode is prefaced with “This show is rated TV-MA” And HBO specifically lists Violence, Nudity, and Sexual Situations as the reason for the rating.
Every. Single. Episode.
Seriously you want a trigger warning? Wish granted.
Comment By: Steve Dooner
May 18th, 2015 at 5:17 pm
Isn’t it more reasonable for the average kitten lover to say: “I love the show, but I just couldn’t watch the scene where they murdered the kittens. ” I’m sure such things happen all the time. Art is supposed to effect us. Don’t try to change it or censor the art. Just say, till next week!
Comment By: Adam-Troy Castro
May 18th, 2015 at 5:17 pm
Every damn episode of the show begins with one of these.
http://cdn.theatlantic.com/assets/media/img/posts/2014/05/hbo/aa4299013.png
Comment By: Russ Whiteman
May 18th, 2015 at 6:20 pm
This all seems like a terrible amount of uproar just because someone came out and publicly stated they are a complete and utter moron.
How else to explain the need for an additional trigger warning after watching five seasons of GoT?
Comment By: Dave Meyer
May 18th, 2015 at 7:17 pm
Agreed, the specific complaint which prompted this essay is absurd. To the broader discussion, though: post traumatic stress cannot be argued away on Facebook. Yes, logically, the TV rating should suffice. But I will never argue that point with someone who has actually been raped or otherwise brutalized and is upset by a tv show. They don’t need an argument; they need support. If their complaints may result in legislation, argue with the politicians instead.
Comment By: Turner
May 18th, 2015 at 9:54 pm
The “Trigger warning” was the scene where she decides to go through with the wedding. Seriously, didn’t everyone really expect WORSE?? If not, you haven’t been paying attention.
Comment By: Josh Olson
May 19th, 2015 at 12:18 am
For fuck’s sake. It’s Game Of Thrones. It’s a gloriously over the top orgy of idiotic sex and gore that revels in horrific acts of cruelty. Hitting the “on” button on your remote to watch this show is how you tell HBO you’re ready to rub rape and murder all over your eyeballs.
Complaining about that scene is like bitching that last night’s Walker Texas Ranger had scenes of mindless jingoism. For fuck’s sake.
Comment By: Josh Olson
May 19th, 2015 at 12:18 am
Dave “I will never argue that point with someone who has actually been raped or otherwise brutalized and is upset by a tv show”
WHAT THE FUCK IS SOMEONE WHO IS TRAUMATIZED BY IMAGES OF RAPE DOING WATCHING GAME OF MOTHER RAPING THRONES????
Comment By: Dave Meyer
May 19th, 2015 at 1:18 am
“Upset by a TV show” doesn’t necessarily mean they are actually watching it, Josh. Sometimes a discussion about trigger warnings is enough to trigger someone who has post traumatic stress. Jim Wright wisely chose not to argue with someone who blew up at him over sharing Adam’s post.
Comment By: Carol Gibson
May 19th, 2015 at 2:42 am
Steve Dooner people asking for trigger warnings are not asking for censorship we don’t want the shows to change or not to have the things that triggers us we would just like a little warning.
Look I think anyone bitching over GoT is off base first of all it has warnings and just doing a web search will tell you how violent it is.
Trigger warnings are really important on shows that are doing something they have never done before. I watch the Flash if they took it really dark and added say graphic child abuse I would really like a warning. I don’t think that is to much to ask.
I can’t remember what show I was watching but they made a special announcement that this episode had adult themes that included graphic torture and violence they has that announcement at the beginning and right before they went to the torture scene.
They did this because it was show that normally didn’t have scenes like that.
Dave Meyer thank you for getting it. It is very frustrating and demoralizing to be treated like an idiot or be treated with disdain over suffering from being triggered over something you were not expecting to see on a TV show.
Honestly to be told that my real suffering in being triggered from something unexpected is not as important as not having a spoiler in show shows the utter lack of empathy for people suffering with PTSD.
The person who made the complaint about GoT really irks me because thanks to them they have managed to completely muddy the water on this topic and make even reasonable requests for warnings look stupid.
Comment By: Steve Dooner
May 19th, 2015 at 6:17 am
Art should cause stress. Art should cause terror. Art should be so beautiful it’s dangerous. The highest and greatest works of art (King Lear, Guernica, The Last Judgment, The Metamorphosis) are all works that “go there.” Art should be risky, and we take risks when we decide to take it in. As Wilde put it, modern criticism is either the rage of Caliban seeing his own face in the glass, or the rage of Caliban not seeing his own face in the glass.
Comment By: Josh L
May 19th, 2015 at 7:02 am
Minor correction. Robb Stark and his wife / unborn child were not murdered shortly after his own wedding. They were murdered at Robb’s uncle’s wedding, which was set up to “apologize” for Robb marrying another woman instead of one of Walder Frey’s daughters as he had previously promised to do so.
I completely agree with your point otherwise. This is Game of Thrones. The very first episode had marital rape, twin incest, and the attempted murder of a 10-year-old boy. What were you expecting? Like Ramsay said in season 3, if you thought there’d be a happy ending, you haven’t been paying attention.
Comment By: Brandy
May 19th, 2015 at 7:46 am
Trigger warnings are becoming a serious issue for artists, especially writers anyway. I can see visual artists in film having issues, as well. Soon, half the book or the first thirty minutes of the program will be a list of possible minute detailed trigger warnings because people can’t be assed to think about researching a subject or putting some thought into where something is going ahead of time. I guess I’m having a very difficult time finding a trigger warning outcry after The Red Wedding. If it’s marrying your rapist, General Hospital did that 30 years ago, Luke and Laura anyone? No trigger warnings then and everyone loved/loves Luke and Laura. Not as if General Hospital is the bastion of fictional television viewing, but for comparative purposes, it works.
Comment By: Nick Wilczynski
May 19th, 2015 at 8:17 am
Rape in Westeros is a thing that happens, sure, it is a world where life is often violent, brutish and short. But what about the books?
I want to talk about the books not just because I think that the TV show has gone dramatically off script in terms of content, I think that this particular scene really demonstrates the thematic split that has happened. What you are essentially saying is that Westeros is not a place where women have any control over what is happening to them, and that by being there these women were asking for it.
But we are in Feast for Crows territory here. The War of the Five Kings is over and we should be in a part of the series best described as the War of the Four Queens. Myrcella, by Dornish Law, is the rightful Queen. Margery is a complex and unpredictable character in the books, you generally see everything from Cersei’s perspective which is glorious. Asha Greyjoy should be angling to be the Reaver Queen. The various trials of Jeyne Poole in Winterfell are not used to stop a character’s development and to reinforce that no matter how practiced they get at “playing the game,” no matter how well they learn to be duplicitous and regardless of how much power they accumulate or how much leverage they have they cannot control their own situation. (Who could have forced Sansa if she had just said “No” at any point? Does the North really remember, or are they willing to let the Lady of Winterfell be raped in her own home?)
I thought she was going to murder Ramsay. I am disappointed that she did not.
Even in Mereen Daeny is just waiting for some Mereenish dude to make her problems go away.
Those sorts of ladies are helpless stories…. they’re played out and boring. I like the books because they don’t rely on those tropes. If GoT was capable of using rape for anything other than shock value I don’t think I would mind, but this isn’t the first time, and I think it’s getting old.
Comment By: Ben Cox
May 19th, 2015 at 8:26 am
Josh Olson: “Hitting the “on” button on your remote to watch this show is how you tell HBO you’re ready to rub rape and murder all over your eyeballs.”
This is truly one of the finest sentences I’ve read in a long time. Thanks for that.
(Fortunately I had already finished my coffee.)
Comment By: Sara B. Slaymaker
May 19th, 2015 at 10:17 am
For the record, I was raped. Three times. I watch GOT. When a rape starts, I change the channel. I don’t expect a trigger warning – as you said, for god’s sake, it’s GAME OF THRONES!!
Comment By: Josh Olson
May 19th, 2015 at 11:18 am
Dave “Sometimes a discussion about trigger warnings is enough to trigger someone”
Indeed. Discussions about trigger warnings are enough to trigger me.
Comment By: 10kats
May 19th, 2015 at 3:54 pm
I stopped watching GoT episodes ago. Do miss the dragons though. I guess this is why they have too many characters to keep up with so they can be killed off one by one. Amazing how people can accept some brutal murders and flip out over others.